@ThatRabidPotato no, you're not the only one. I prefer the MS, but SO also has a lot of merits

The issue in my opinion is not liking SO. It comes from the way the author handled, or rather, created the mess.

1. He said that SO is optional for the main series. Then we do get a lot of fleshing out for Ais. People who have read SO despite it being optional will find Ais-Bell scene in MSV17 more understandable and different than those who took the author's word for it and did not read the SO series.

2. The same goes for Freya's search regarding her Odr. It was more fleshed out in an optional side series even though it had an effect on the main series.

3. Ryu getting the Magic Key Ball to Knossos. Those who only read the MS because SO side story was optional would be like, Darn, a Deus-ex-machina(assuming I know the meaning of deus-ex-machina correctly) that Ryu had it. Those who read the Optional series would know the answer.

4. The fight with Filvis in Vol12 was disappointing because someone should have died. The fact that nobody died was plot convenience.

5. Again, Ais is the main female lead. In the Main series, she is not fleshed out much. It is only in an optional side series that she is much more fleshed out.

Don't get me wrong. I love the series, but I hate the way it is important to the main series but still optional!

Also I hate the plot conveniences author pulls. Heck, just level up Gareth already. He has already performed the deed!

>The fight with Filvis in Vol12 was disappointing because someone should have died. The fact that nobody died was plot convenience.

some lower levels are really died if I remember correctly

@Angelo Gabrini

I have seen your comments complaining about the length of the volumes, such as volume 14, which has more than 600 pages, and about the fact that Ais has been very secondary in the main series, so I wanted to point out that if Ais and the Loki family had been given a lot of development in MS, the novels could have been over 1000 pages. This case reminds me of "Game of Thrones", that work also has a lot of characters and as the author does develop them all in the same work, each novel has more than a thousand pages (letter size).

Yes, it is possible to only develop the characters that will be most relevant to the volume in question and leave the rest aside, however, that would generate unavoidable delays in the development of characters that, although they are not essential for the volume, are essential for the series, like Ais for example, left in the secondary role during the whole main series because she couldn't be very relevant until now, so your idea hasn't worked as well as expected, that's why I think that managing the narrative from two parallel novels focused on different perspectives is the best solution. Imagine, for example, if in addition to Ais, Lefiya had also been very important and well-developed in the MS, then the number of pages would necessarily have to be significantly increased or start discarding the characters that until now have been protagonists in MS, too many relevant characters!

On the complaints of the volume 17:

Danmachi is a shonen essentially, however this arc has been quite dramatic, I personally don't mind because I like romance, but for pure shonen fans who follow this series, they shouldn't be very happy with so much romantic drama, That's why I think it would have been good to have at least part of the development of the fights spelled out, and I'm not the only one who thinks so, that scene of Hogni fighting with Ais, Tiona and Tione has given rise to endless debates on this wiki.

But regardless of the theme of the volume, that the author of a work is cutting scenes of interest seems to me a bad practice, that's why I said that it's okay if he did it because he is going to develop the facts in another work but if it is not like that, it means that he loves suspense and I hate it, this series is not suspenseful! But as you said, it's something subjective, there will be fans who like the author not to develop the facts and leave them in suspense, but not me.

Regarding knowing Ais's feelings in each event, yes, it is true that it is not necessary in all cases but in this particular case it is, because a conflict has arisen over who will stay with Bell as a man and it is of great interest for the work to know exactly Ais's feelings about it, remember that the romance between Bell and Ais is one of the central axes of the series (Liaris Freese!), and also I sincerely hope that at the end of this arc Ais and Bell's relationship progress significantly, even if they do not become boyfriends at the end of this one, at least that the commitment between them is formalized, and for this purpose it is essential to know Ais's feelings, and usually these have been addressed in Sword Oratoria, not in MS, I also remember that you have complained about the lack of development between the two then...!

@IkariSon no names cannon fodder die all the time in danmachi for warp effect. someone whose death will affect the readers in some way that will stay I meant. apologies for the confusion.

The only named ones that have died are line arshe and friends and my only complaint regarding that it is that I wished line and bete's relation was more explored before her death. It would have had a greater impact then. otherwise I am fine with that.

However, those cannon fodder of ganesha familiar who died against filvis were there to die. even oomori probably does not remember their names, and he created them. I meant the idiotic group who was fighting filvis. that was the biggest letdown because filvis could have and should have killed haruhime logically but did not because plot.

To be honest I think you are overestimating the importance of the battles at Folkvangr at the end of volume 17. They were basically short-lived confrontations that got interrupted with no conclusion. At the most I'd say that they might have been slight teasers into what to expect for volume 18, but anything might happen in volume 18, so maybe not even that.

I think at least a small portion of SO13 will take place during volume 17 even if the volume does for sure end up taking place during volume 19.

Too many unanswered questions or hints to SO13's plot during volume 17 to ignore addressing them. Like why did Riveria and Lefiya go so far into the dungeon without any of the other members of Loki's elites, and what happened in the dungeon with the Freya Familia reconnaissance team lead by Noga that was sent to keep an eye on them? Not to mention Noga was also in AR1, so it's pretty obvious he/she will be in SO13.

That tweet was made a long time ago as well, Oomori could have possibly changed his mind like he did with vol.12 of the main series and pushed what he originally planned for SO13's plot to SO14, but it might still be the same.

@ThatRabidPotato A lot of us had to wait awhile for SO volumes to come out. That gave us lots of time to think about what could, should, or might happen. SO12 had a lot riding on it. It was the culmination of the previous eleven volumes, so expectation really couldn't have been higher. And a number of fans were not happy with what we ended up getting.

SO is at the end of the day is about the Loki Familia in general and Ais in particular. To see them grow and over come their challenges, to develop and change as they live through events. What we ended up getting in volume 12 was nothing they had learned in the preceding volumes really making any difference. They get bailed out at the last moment by GBA(Grand Bell Argonaut) and the Freya Familia.

Having them be assisted if fine, but having help only show up at the in moments when Freya and Hestia Familias have just as much at stake takes away from the actual main cast and makes absolutely no practical sense. Freya Familia helping is fine but they should have been there from the start of the operation. The narrative need Loki Familia to win the day, maybe with some help, but certainly not with GBA dues ex machina.

Ais and Bell developing is would be nice, but all we got was Ais taking a nap next to Bell and her hearing GBA and magically overcoming her hatred. There was so much more that could have been done with that. Desperate was already breaking, having is shatter as a symbolic show of her hates self destructiveness and truly putting her in dire straits could have given that moment more weight. With Ais having to face that she was going to die thinking about her friends, then her parents, and finally a certain boy. Only to find Bell's knife in front of her that he lost in Knossos. Then using the very tactic she taught him to kill Revis with the Ushi-Wakamaru-Nishiki and her mother wind. And rather than the nap have Bell give her the knife.

Another major thing was getting Lefiya out of her funk. That should have been Ais not Loki. Ais has tried so hard to help her friends when they were having trouble only to have it blow up in her face each time. This was the perfect point to have that desire to be there for her friend finally have some payoff. Something as simple as asking Lefiya not to become like her, a product of her own destructive hatred.

There was just so much that could have been done with SO 12 and it felt like it was just used to show off how amazing Bell and his friends were at the end. Almost every part of this volume could have and probably should have been done better.

Now there nothing wrong with being satisfied with what you got and enjoying what is there. But some people are going to have different expectation and if those aren't met, along with something like the rampant abuse of plot armor in MS14 can be enough to cause a loss of faith in the author.

@Kisaki Tosane

How could SO13 take place during DM19 if SO13 and 14 will be released right after DM18? that would mean that SO would advance the timeline of DM.

I thought SO13 would take place during DM17 and show us the perspective of the Loki family charmed by Freya and Riveria and Lefiya's expedition and SO14 would take place during DM18 and we would see the performance of the Loki family during the war game.

But if SO overcomes DM's timeline, wouldn't this be a spoiler for the main series?

@Leinad91

SO13 and 14 could still be in the time line after or around MS 19 if the story is not going to be inside Orario. No one has bought this up but if you look pass Lefiya and Loki the back round city art does not look like anything we have seen of Orario. At less from any of the book art idk if its something we seen in the games.

So maybe this new ark of SO is going to be about the Loki Familia taking care of something big for the guild outside of the city. Like with certain magic city that keeps getting bought up both in early SO and in Familia chronicle Freya.

Just me thinking got nothing to go on but the back round art to go on for this but it could be use to keep Bell out of SO if well he is half a world away and can't just pop up out of the blue and take all the lime light away. Also on the flip side this would mean that nothing to much would need to be said about SO in the MS if most of Loki Familia is again on the other side of the world doing their own thing. Maybe just a well Loki Familia is being sent to do a mission for the guild.

The only problem would be Ais not being in the MS again but that could be fix if she and some of the others say in Orario to keep the city's fighting force up. Maybe working with Hestia Familia on a mission in the Dungeon or something.