"Some" people think that just because she isn't good at fighting people like she is to monster, she is pretty weak. Which is nonsense.

@Rigel31415

Aisha did the same in DM12. Although they never fought since Bell became Level 4 she was able to accurately tell his prowess in each aspect due to seeing him fight in their way to the Water City When Finn got rid of the remnants of evil,

among which there was not a single first-class, Hogni instantly got rid of one of the level 5 spirit warriors.

Even here their achievement is not commensurate.

For example, what if when he called Hogni the most skilled in melee combat he had forgotten that Allen is actually more skilled?

Let's not compare an event that is already a little over two years old, I'm sure that at that time the author practically did not think through the full strength of the Freya family, which is hinted at by the cut fights that appeared only in the LN version.You say that there is no way to say that this is not a clear statement, but also no way to say that this statement is true.

Omori showed this through Valleta's dialogue, but not through the narrator's point of view, which also doesn't lend credibility.

50% to 50% until Finn has done a decent job, let's not judge that as a fact, I can't deny that it's true, but you can't really say it's true either, so we'll just rule it out.

Just like the Gulliver brothers and Ottar.They may have great coordination and be many, but due to how slow they are compared to him Ottar has no problem dealing with them.

It literally says that any attack from them can kill him, but the gulf between them and the gulf between them is too high.

Revis was originally faster than Finn, and also it's been 3 volumes since their last meeting, she's probably gotten even stronger. She could have killed Gareth when she switched to speed but was thwarted, they literally override each other's weaknesses with teamwork.

Physical prowess also matters, and a lot. Asterius has an utter lack of technique, yet even skilled warriors like Bete, Tiona and Tione have no hope against him in a 1vs1, simply because his raw might is too superior to theirs.

Are you saying that the gap between Asterius and Loki's new elite will be the same as the one between Hogni and Finn and Hell finagas??

You're comparing at least a medium-high level 7 monster and low level 6 adventurers, the same Bete doesn't have the weapon to properly hit him, and there's a line where he was able to fight him for a while, at their huge difference.

Moreover, it also says that an adventurer can never achieve the body strength that Asterius has, comparisons between monsters and people of the same level are incorrect, you are literally using ridiculous facts to justify your point of view.

Literally says that the abyss of 1 level is not the limit, because Mikoto barely coped with the adventurer on the level below, because he was an einheria (strong warrior) from the Freya family, even of a low rank.

Naturally, I can show you this line so you can see for yourself.

Also, I read the scenes. I agree with what the japanese readers said in my wall, at no point was it said, shown or implied anything that suggested Hogni was a match for both

You should reconsider your blog, Kisaki literally retracted his words and said there is a line confirming that Hogni fought two.

Angelo also corrected that he was wrong, and another user also confirmed it.

Page number? I don't mean to be rude, but I think it is pretty obvious why I am skeptical to that.

“I always assumed she was long dead by the time they stopped Gale Wind’s rampage that finished off the last of those Evils five years ago. That means, during the Twenty-Seventh-Floor Nightmare…” Raul added, equally as stiff. Loki Familia had naturally been involved in the extermination of the Evils for the past fifteen years. Having joined the familia eight years ago, Raul and Aki were all too familiar with the events that had taken place.

Unfortunately, I was wrong, those were Raul's words.

You can also check this out by reading chapter 2 of volume 7 of the Oratoria.

Everything you say about Finn being second in strength is based only on Valletta's words, not the narrator's.

Still, none of us can say that they are 100% true or false, so this argument may not be used until Finn shows the proper result.

You also cite as an example that Lefia could watch the fight Bete level 5, although the difference in their speeds is simply incommensurable and the difference there is 2 levels, in that case Hogni superior in technique easily handle Finn 7 with the characteristics of I 0 Because even with a 2 level difference, Lefia who is a mage sees the movements of the fastest vanguard family Beta.

On this one I will ask to leave this argument, because of the achievements Finn has only a line, in the fidelity of which you yourself think.

Until Finn really shows his maximum, I won't think he can really surpass even Allen or Hedin.

@Noon123 No one thinks so. It's just that Ais fans have a habit of making her achievements look higher than they really are. Just because she's not in the top 10 adventurers doesn't make her weak. Please don't make up suggestions like that just because your favorite character wasn't placed in the top 10.

@Hognithebest

Uh sorry there was one dude in reddit that went as far as lying about what wrote in vol 12 of SO, refused author's statements and a lot more.

"Please don't make up suggestions like that just because your favorite character wasn't placed in the top 10."

This is not even an official list. The guy ranked Ryuu higher than Bete, it's not even worth to mention.

The user name also checks out.

@IkariSon

"does it matter? it's still a skill she didn't deserve. we have many peoples with a fate more tragic than hers, but none of them got the Avenger."

Wtf?

do you disagree?

>The guy ranked Ryuu higher than Bete, it's not even worth to mention.

post is clearly said that Bete without moon and Hati while Ryuu haven't such troubles

Personally yes, I disagree.

why

@Noon123 There was also someone on Reddit who claimed that Ais was capable of using Tempest-Avenger on people by presenting them as monsters. And this is only a small part of what is claimed there.

So you were offended by a list made by an ordinary person on the wiki? The person didn't add Ais to the list and you immediately started writing that she's weak, but just because she's not in the top 10 doesn't make her weak.

So what's wrong with that? He was factoring in Bete without Moon and Hati.