All posts by DingoDongo4
When I say I look through Bell's perspective, what I mean is that I try to look at his reasonings, or experiences. This is why I didn't really include Ais standing up to Ottar, because Bell probably doesn't even know this happened at all. I want to see some reason that Ais should stand clearly above Ryu, or at least close to her. For reference I'm not compelled by "love at first sight" or anything like that. Sure that happens in real life, but it's not compelling for me to read, I want to see their interactions together.
Yet, when I try to look at through their relationship through Bell's eyes I don't see why Ais would stand at the top. Earlier in the story I could, but at this point I cannot. Appearance wise, he seems to find them both attractive. He trained with Ais, but hasn't he trained with Ryu more at this point? He fell in love when Ais saved him like a hero, but can't you call Ryu a hero too? She has done so in much more "high stake" situations. Bell might not keep track of how risky it was, but I can't equate beating a minotaur to slaying the juggernaut.
Ais certainly likes Bell to some growing extent, and it's easy to assume they will share more impactful moments later in the story, but what about right now? She couldn't fight in the war game sure.. but not even with training? Other members of the Loki Familia came out to help Bell train, but not Ais? I suppose Bell probably wouldn't know what the reason Ais refused to help was, but it certainly doesn't help things, it just makes the difference harder to ignore. Bell is a top priority for Ryu, but he is not for Ais.
Ais might not have a "free pass" but, that would only make Ryu more appealing, they even share the same Familia now. This will only make it easier for their relationship to develop. In contrast Bell and Ais are in different Familia's and Hestia/Loki hate each other. Ryu has already confessed her love too, so what is it that makes Ais so much more compelling, enough to keep pushing for? I don't see anything that really stands out, and that is the problem.
It makes it come across as something that is just being forced by the plot. This is why I consider it extremely poor writing. I'm fine with Ais taking her time, there have been many other.. "contenders" so to speak, but none of them were similar to Ais, so they were easy for me to write off. Ais was the "strong hero" something they can't compete with. That's when Ryu stole Ais' thunder completely, Ryu can easily be described as the "strong hero" type. While Ais is sitting on the sidelines Ryu is fulfilling that role now. The author shouldn't have ever allowed this situation to happen and yet this is what he decided to do.
When I imagine the upcoming Ais arc, what am I hoping to see? Ais saves Bell, Bell saves Ais, she falls in love with him, that kind of thing. That seems very similar to the Ryu arc, which goes to magnify how Ryu has just stolen Ais' spot. I'm sure he'll probably end up with Ais in the end, but right now Ryu looks a lot more compelling to me.
Edit: I split the 2 replies up, to make the wall of text look less crazy. I will try to be a bit more concise in the future.
"Can you name one thing Bell has faced in the entire series that Ryu has helped him with that Ais wouldn't have waxed in one nano second?"
"Again, this whole argument is useless because Bell does not agree with you."
Imagine a game of basketball. Ais vs Ryu, all that matters is that the most points wins and Omori is the referee. Ryu is going on a tear landing 3 pointers on a wide open net, meanwhile Ais is sitting on the bench, out on foul. She used to have a lead, but by the time her penalty is over it's already gone. Determined to regain the lead, Ais lines up for a 3 pointer, she'll save Bell in the war game... "STOP, no 3 pointers allowed!" Omori calls out. Change of plans, she can't join the war game, but she can still help him train for it. Ais jumps up for the dunk, but a split second before the ball goes in a whistle rings out. Omori just blew the "UNO REVERSE" whistle, meaning the nets swap places. Her eyes go wide... she just dunked on herself.. "-2 POINTS FOR TEAM AIS". Ryu gets the ball, and she scores a 3 pointer. Ais complains to the referee, "You said 3 pointers weren't allowed!", For daring to complain Omori rewards Ryu with 2 free penalty shots. Ryu scores, joining the Hestia Familia. Ryu now has a substantial lead over Ais. It's not fair, Omori keeps sabotaging Ais, but the only thing that matters is the points.
That might not be the best example, but do you get my point? It doesn't matter if it's fair or not. People talk about some story events as if they HAD to happen, but they didn't Omori just chose them to happen that way. Omori has intentionally set up Ryu and Ais to be in competition. It didn't have to be this way, Omori wrote it this way.
When looking at which pairing I would consider the "best" I'm not going to judge off of what I THINK might happen next. Especially not when Omori has proven my expectations wrong on multiple occasions. That leaves the current state of affairs, and Ryu is the more compelling pairing for me currently. I personally consider this to be a failure of bad writing, but in reality it's probably exactly what Omori wanted to happen.
I think it's on Omori to make Ais and Bell's relationship more compelling than any other. I'm certainly no writer, but one thing I've always heard is a writer should show, not tell. Ryu has shown her commitment repeatedly, Ais' showings have been rather slim in comparison as of late. I'm not going to be compelled until Ais shows something more. I won't go over all the points I mentioned earlier, you get the idea.
I would agree with Leinad, in the sense that I only care about what I would consider a "good" relationship development. I also generally judge things through Bell's perspective, since he's the main character.
It goes without saying the love is extremely one sided right now, Bell is all in and Ais isn't in at all. The comparison to Ryu just seems laughably unfair. Ryu has risked her life on the regular to save Bell and I consider that incredibly important.
Ais certainly saved Bell's life many times early on in the story, but the difference is that she wasn't risking herself, it was all a piece of cake for her. Exception being when she briefly fought Ottar, unfortunately I don't think Bell would even be aware of that. I thought the war game in volume 18 would be the perfect time to turn it around and then.... she just abandoned him. She didn't partake in the war game and she wasn't shown trying to convince Riveria or Finn to join the war game. She didn't even help Bell train, despite making a previous promise to train him again at some point.
If Bell owed someone a favor and they asked him to abandon Ais in her time of need, I've no doubt in my mind he would ignore the favor and help Ais. In other words the given reason for her to abandon him is useless to me.
Ryu once again risks her life to save Bell, and confesses her love too. She's strong, she's an elf (Bell revealed early on that he has a preference for Elves) and she's blonde (another preference.. I think). At this point the difference is just downright glaring between the pairings, it's on life support fueled purely by the plot. Just extremely poor writing, If Omori really holds the rest of their development until the final arc/last few novels it's gonna feel sooo forced. He needs to start the development A.S.A.P.
If you're looking for an excuse as for why powerful opponents would attack now instead of earlier, the war game is an obvious reasoning. Forget Freya's Familia, nothing matters if Freya can just one shot the universe itself with her charm. Outside of Orario people might believe that Freya herself has left Orario.
The Xenos "four" was listed as a level 5 on the website, but he was defeated very easily by a level 5 adventurer in dix. I always took this to mean that the "level" of a monster is supposed to represent the level of an adventurer required to be able to "safely" defeat the monster.
For example, I can't really imagine even a fresh level 2 Welf losing to a minotaur 1v1. Of course, it's fair to say most of the adventurer's we see in combat are going to be the more "exceptional" ones, so it's hard to say for certain.
Edit: Perhaps this just gives more value to dexterity as a stat. Dexterity is by far the hardest stat for me to quantify it's advantage in a fight.
Ottar achieved level "8" power by being a maxed out level 7 with beastification. To me this is like how we've seen bell with his stats maxed out be able to contend with someone a level higher. As a low level 8 I don't think beastification would push him to a level 9 tier, just maybe a high level 8. This is speculation of course.
Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I'm aware, Bell is only one of two adventurer's shown to have ever used a limit off. Speaking of which, has Bell even used limit off himself without Argonaut? The only other character that I'm aware of to ever show a limit off is Alfia, who did it via a skill and coincidentally is also the only other character to surpass the stat cap of 999.
The only two people shown to have ever used limit off could do so at will. If no one else has ever shown a limit off regardless of how dire the circumstances are, isn't that odd? Why should we assume they can do it at all? Why did the author make up a reason that Bell couldn't use his limit off at the start of the fight, if Ottar could just limit off to counter himself?
In regards to the final battle I think it makes sense to look at every possible tool that could be pulled out in regards to a character's full power. Which would also include Ryu's Astrae Varmas skill, which amplifies the skills of those who are in the same familia, so that would be another boost that Bell could get, but Ottar can't. (unless he joins the Hestia familia of course)
I see this as the way the author intends to have Bell play a decisive role without being the strongest adventurer individually. Skills like Vanadis Tevere or Ryu's Astrae Varmas combined with the fact Argonaut's full power takes too long for Bell to be able to use on his own.
Alternatively, maybe his presence will just serve to buff Ais like it did in her battle against Revis, and she will be the star of the show. Just like the beginning of the story, Bell being saved by Ais again, wouldn't that be funny? /s
@Leinad91 If Bell hits level 7, I would think his Argo Vesta would be significantly stronger than Ottar's Hildis Vini.
A low level 5 Bell's Argonaut was an even match for a high level 7 Ottar's Hildis Vini. I'm going to be assuming Bell's "Limit off" would be equivalent to Ottar's beastification. If this is the case let's look at the changes.
Ottar gains 1 level.
Bell gains 2 levels + all the stats involved and he presumably activates his Vanadis Tevere skill (it's the final fight surely it will be activated in some way).
If they were equal before, how could they possibly be equal now? Ottar's Hildis Vini may be a lot faster, but I can't see how it could be anywhere close to equaling Bell's Argo Vesta in sheer power.